3dfx Archive - 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700

trevormacro God Member Offline Voodoo5k6 Gold SE, Legend & Mystical Edition Posts: 622 Gender:	Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700 Reply #120 - 03.07.13 at 16:28:52 Loeschzwerg wrote on 03.07.13 at 14:52:27: Depends on the smart tweezer, it must be capable of measuring more than 10MHz (a common limit on cheaper multimeters an tweezers). This one: http://es.farnell.com/ideal-tek/st-5/meter-lcr-2-5x14x3mm-53g/dp/2064744 Is it good?
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goriath God Member Offline Ruggedized Retro Gamer Posts: 599 Italy/Slovenija Gender:	Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700 Reply #121 - 03.07.13 at 16:41:30 It's an LCR meter, it means is suitable only to measure inductance capacitance and resistance.
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m14radu God Member Offline Take your chance ! Posts: 555 Timisoara, Romania Gender:	Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700 Reply #122 - 03.07.13 at 21:02:51 @Osckhar: did you change the crystal ?
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trevormacro

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Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700
Reply #123 - 04.07.13 at 01:50:05

m14radu wrote on 03.07.13 at 21:02:51:

@Osckhar: did you change the crystal ?

Oscar tried the Rampage crystal on a Voodoo4 and it work.
After that, he tried the Voodoo4 crystal on the Rampage and it doesn't work. Sad

The crystal Y1 is not the problem.

My website is updated for pictures of the rework.

Next step:

Oscar wait the smart tweezer to test all components and compare them to his card.

If anyone have any solutions feel free to post them please

How is possible the orignal chip was dead. It can be a clue why the card does not work.
Perhaps chip does not work when it was placed bad in the socket and for such reason burned some components even the rampage card.

History of the RN112 on the card:

RN112 was missing because it was used to repaired other rampage card. The 4 resistors added instead of RN112 are good for the card. It's not the problem.

Regards,
Trevor.

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« Last Edit: 04.07.13 at 04:58:44 by trevormacro »

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goriath

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Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700
Reply #124 - 04.07.13 at 14:23:42

trevormacro wrote on 04.07.13 at 01:50:05:

How is possible the orignal chip was dead. It can be a clue why the card does not work.
Perhaps chip does not work when it was placed bad in the socket and for such reason burned some components even the rampage card.

History of the RN112 on the card:

RN112 was missing because it was used to repaired other rampage card. The 4 resistors added instead of RN112 are good for the card. It's not the problem.

Regards,
Trevor.

Honestly I have some difficulties to understand what you tell time by time. I may be wrong but I remember your BGA worked on the Oscar's board, isn't it? So, nobody can be sure at the moment but your BGA should work.

Since PCB is warped, that could mean some internal electrical traces are broken, or maybe not, you never know.

RN112 was missing because it was used to repaired other rampage card - This statement could be a clue about the condition of your board. Maybe that card was unfunctional already when left 3dfx facilities, so they might have used it for spare parts.

But, if RN112 can be replaced by resistors, why they didn't use resistors to repair the other Rampage?

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gdonovan

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Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700
Reply #125 - 04.07.13 at 15:31:50

Quote:

RN112 was missing because it was used to repaired other rampage card - This statement could be a clue about the condition of your board. Maybe that card was unfunctional already when left 3dfx facilities, so they might have used it for spare parts.

I was thinking the same thing, logic would lead one to that conclusion.

It did pop in my head that the pack could have been used on an unsocketed board as one would imagine that they were a bit more stable than the socketed units.

Just a passing note before I have to head back to the hospital, Hank mentioned during a phone call I had with him that all the Rampage chips made tested live, there was no failures. That doesn't mean though that after 12-13 years they have not been hit by static electricity once or twice.

But if the chip tested good on Oscars board then the problem lies somewhere else.

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« Last Edit: 04.07.13 at 15:38:05 by gdonovan »

Rampage is alive!

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trevormacro

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Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700
Reply #126 - 04.07.13 at 16:45:55

goriath wrote on 04.07.13 at 14:23:42:

trevormacro wrote on 04.07.13 at 01:50:05:

How is possible the orignal chip was dead. It can be a clue why the card does not work.
Perhaps chip does not work when it was placed bad in the socket and for such reason burned some components even the rampage card.

History of the RN112 on the card:

RN112 was missing because it was used to repaired other rampage card. The 4 resistors added instead of RN112 are good for the card. It's not the problem.

Regards,
Trevor.

Honestly I have some difficulties to understand what you tell time by time. I may be wrong but I remember your BGA worked on the Oscar's board, isn't it? So, nobody can be sure at the moment but your BGA should work.

Since PCB is warped, that could mean some internal electrical traces are broken, or maybe not, you never know.

RN112 was missing because it was used to repaired other rampage card - This statement could be a clue about the condition of your board. Maybe that card was unfunctional already when left 3dfx facilities, so they might have used it for spare parts.

But, if RN112 can be replaced by resistors, why they didn't use resistors to repair the other Rampage?

The first rampage chip who came with the card doesn't work for now.
The second chip I had works on oscar's rampy.
Good question about the RN112 but no answer for now.

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m14radu God Member Offline Take your chance ! Posts: 555 Timisoara, Romania Gender:	Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700 Reply #127 - 04.07.13 at 17:48:58 Why we don't measure the RN112 Input/Output voltages on Osckhar Card, and compare them with the RN112 Input/Output voltages from Michael Card ? If there are differences we have a clue
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trevormacro

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Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700
Reply #128 - 05.07.13 at 01:28:11

m14radu wrote on 04.07.13 at 17:48:58:

Why we don't measure the RN112 Input/Output voltages on Osckhar Card, and compare them with the RN112 Input/Output voltages from Michael Card ?
If there are differences we have a clue

Oscar have checked it in parallel mode to compared with the others resistor pack. The value is different and in the others is the same (the only different is the individual resistence Hank added).
He also checked with his card and all the resistor pack have same value.
According to Hank it's not the problem because it can be bypassed with individual 25ohm 0402 resistors and tested. But since this is the first card in the lab, he think it would be inappropriate to modify it.

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« Last Edit: 05.07.13 at 01:32:43 by trevormacro »

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Tim God Member Offline Posts: 1065 Gender:	Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700 Reply #129 - 05.07.13 at 10:17:28 Keep up the good work guys. Congrats on the Rampage trevor. Hope you get it to work in the end.
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m14radu God Member Offline Take your chance ! Posts: 555 Timisoara, Romania Gender:	Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700 Reply #130 - 05.07.13 at 11:17:56 If the values are different between the cards, swapping the RN112 from a runnig care to yours could reveal the thruth. I know they are ptototypes an a swap is not recommeded
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osckhar

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Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700
Reply #131 - 05.07.13 at 12:00:56

Yupe, many questions without answer.

- Why chip is dead? ESD problems? Yes, it could be but I guess if chip is placed in bad postion since a lot of traces on the substrates are connected 'possibly' some PCB smd part could be 'burned' for NOT right voltage. It could explain why chip is dead and why card is NOT working.

- RN112- Odd about such resistor pack. Why 3Dfx ordered a custom resistor pack when with individual smd resistence has same effect? reduce costs? I either understand why 3Dfx requested a custom resistor pack when with individual resistence gets same results.

- Oscar.

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Quaker763

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Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700
Reply #132 - 06.07.13 at 09:33:17

goriath wrote on 04.07.13 at 14:23:42:

Since PCB is warped, that could mean some internal electrical traces are broken, or maybe not, you never know.

I guess it would depend on how badly the card is warped. I agree with goriath in that it actually may be the board not the chip or components. Does anyone have any idea how the card got warped in the first place?

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« Last Edit: 06.07.13 at 09:33:54 by Quaker763 »

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trevormacro God Member Offline Voodoo5k6 Gold SE, Legend & Mystical Edition Posts: 622 Gender:	Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700 Reply #133 - 18.07.13 at 16:14:50 @Quaker763: No idea. @All: Website updated! The chip is now unsolded from the pcb. Need to reball now.
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trevormacro God Member Offline Voodoo5k6 Gold SE, Legend & Mystical Edition Posts: 622 Gender:	Re: 3dfx Specter 1000 AGP TEST SOCKET Rev.A1 4700 Reply #134 - 24.07.13 at 17:09:16 My Rampy card is return to his original state and in good condition. Website updated with a picture.
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